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[Heidi] Hey everybody, this is Heidi St. John. Welcome to the podcast. Today’s Friday, December the 20th. You guys were so close to Christmas, and I’ve got some great news for you. Are you ready? We’re going to take a break from talking about all the Christmas stuff and the culture stuff and we’re going to talk about sex and not the bad kind as in comprehensive sex education. We’re going to talk about the joys of married sex, in particular, as it relates to women. Stick around. I think you’re going to be encouraged.

All right you guys, so thanks for tuning in today. Thank you to everybody who is sending us cards in our Christmas card Palooza. We are having a fantastic time reading those. Love that I heard from Esther in Switzerland, a little handwritten note from her. Thank you Esther for writing to us. It’s really fun. We’re putting your notes up as they are able to be put up. We are putting them up here at Firmly Planted Family. Love that we heard from Heather and her family in Galton, Texas, or I’m sorry, in Gallatin, Tennessee. You guys, we are so excited to be seeing your pictures and hearing your stories of how the podcast is affecting your lives, so thank you very much for doing that.

I wanted to let you guys know that I’m going to be traveling again. My speaking season begins in January and I’m going to spend the first week of January, the fourth through the 12th speaking for the Florida Parent Educators Association’s marriage crews, and we’re going to be going to don’t feel too bad. I’m suffering for the Lord. I know, I know. I can hear it. I can hear it in your voices. My husband and I will be in the Caribbean for that cruise for those eight days along with my friend Todd Wilson and his wife Debbie. And so we just want to encourage you, first of all, if you’re coming on the cruise, we can’t wait to see you. If you’re not, please pray for us because we’re going to be doing a lot of work with marriages that particular week and I believe, and I know my guest today is going to agree with me 100%, we’ve got to protect our marriages and so this is going to be a theme for me in January and obviously in February just to be encouraging you in your marriage.

So one of the reasons I’m excited about today’s guest is she shares that passion with me and her focus has been particularly on encouraging couples in their sexual relationship, which if we’re honest, the world has done a pretty good job of messing this up.

And so my friend today is Sheila Wray Gregoire. I’ve had her on the show with me before and I always get great feedback whenever she comes on. I’m like, this is great, Sheila because I love to talk about sex. We should be talking about it. Sheila is a popular speaker. She blogs about marriage. She’s the author of eight books, including The Good Girl’s Guide to Great Sex. She loves encouraging women in their relationships, both with God and with their husbands. Sheila Wray Gregoire, welcome to the podcast.

[Sheila] Thank you Heidi. We are going to have some fun today.

[Heidi] I know it’s Christmas. We should be having some fun.

[Sheila] Absolutely.

[Heidi] We should be having some fun. Yeah, give the moms a break from all the Christmas wrapping that still needs to be done. And the kids who are just there. They need you every minute of every day. So I’m excited to have you. You just told me that you’re getting over a cold. So if we hear your voice crack, it’s okay.

[Sheila] Yes. But Hey, I’m over it. So I’m almost over it. And that’s exciting cause Christmas is coming, and I don’t want it come Christmas.

[Heidi] Christmas is coming.

[Sheila] Yeah.

[Heidi] No, no, a couple of weeks ago I was talking to everybody about being a Grinch. You know, nobody wants to be around the mom who’s like, “I do everything for you people.” And I got to thinking, this is a perfect segue into having you on the show because sometimes as women, we can become martyrs, right?

[Sheila] Oh yeah.

[Heidi] You know, we’re our own worst enemy and we don’t even realize it. And something that you and I have talked about over the years quite a bit is this area of intimacy, sexual intimacy, in marriage. And you have a real heart to encourage these women that sex isn’t just for your husband. It’s for you, right? It’s for, it’s for the wives also.

[Sheila] Yeah. Like what if God created something which is supposed to be really amazing for both of you and which was supposed to help you feel better and more relaxed and more in love. And instead of embracing it, we just ignored it and tried to put it at the bottom of our to-do list. Like wouldn’t that be sad?

[Heidi] Yeah, or you make it feel like it’s on the to do list and that kind of ruins it. Right? My husband’s over in the control room and he’s like, “thumbs up, big thumbs up.” You know the men who are listening to this today, the husbands are listening to this going, “I’m going to, where’s my wife? I want her to download this podcast today.” Because what we’re going to talk about today is why sex is important for women in particular. I think we all know why it’s important for men. And you and I were talking about this before the show started, that this is something that churches focus on. Wives should be taking care of your husbands, your wives, husbands have a, usually a stronger sex drive than their wives do. And so we tend to focus on that. And you said something I thought was so good, you said you think that’s making the problem of a wife lacking desire even worse. Why do you say that?

[Sheila] Oh yeah. Cause like who wants duty sex? Who wants obligation sex? That’s just terrible. No woman wants that. But that’s what we grow up here and you know, “Oh the poor guy, he needs it so much. You just need to help him out or else he’ll explode every three days.” And that just makes you feel like, “Oh great. So I’m…”

[Heidi] Yeah. Then when we get out the to do list and there it goes,

[Sheila] here I am, I’m leaking milk and I’ve got kids throwing up on me and now he needs me. He needs my body or else he’s going to explode. And it’s like, when do I get to matter? You know, when do I get to matter? And so we grow up thinking guys need sex and women don’t because even as a teenager, right, you’re told, Oh you better watch what you wear or he’s going to lust after you. So as a teen you feel like my body is bad and he and all guys are lusting, but I’m not, which is… Here’s a total aside that really bothered both of my girls, cause both of my girls said they were totally unprepared for turning 14 and 15 and suddenly noticed that guys six packs. And so they thought that they were like weird or something. Cause I didn’t know girls had sex drives. So that’s just a bad message, right?

[Heidi] Well, and I want to say something too. You’re not saying you’re not knocking modesty.

[Sheila] No.

[Heidi] You’re not saying, “Hey, whatever you want to, doesn’t matter if guys are more visually stimulated than women are.” You’re not, that’s not the message.

[Sheila] No. What I’m saying is that girls are not responsible for men. For guys’ sin. And when we phrase it that way, then girls can feel like I am the cause of sin. You know, my body is the cause of sin and guys want sex and I don’t. Then they grow up and they get married and this message gets then other messages are adding onto it. Like if he doesn’t get sex every three days, he’s not going to feel loved. He’s not going to be able to talk to you. He’s going to emotionally withdraw. And you just kind of feel like God is using your body. Like He’s forcing you to do something or else God is going to be mad at you.

[Heidi] Well talk to the woman who that is her reality.

[Sheila] Yeah.

[Heidi] I mean, so that is a reality. So if she notices, okay, it’s been three days and my husband’s emotionally withdrawing from me. He’s not talking to me. I feel like I’ve done something wrong. I’m getting the silent treatment, whatever it is. And it sort of perpetuates that. It really does it. I mean, what has just happened is what she believed about it just got reinforced.

[Sheila] Exactly. And now because she doesn’t really want sex to begin with, she’s going to withdraw even more because now she’s mad at him. And so this, it’s all this really bad cycle. And so how do we stop the cycle? And the message that we often hear is that the way you stop the cycle is just by having more sex. And what I want to say is, no, hold on a second. That’s not the way you stop the cycle. You can’t just force your body to go through something. What we need to do instead is go back to first principles and say, what did God make sex for? And God did not make sex so that your husband could feel great while you laid there and just wish that he would get it over with.

[Heidi] Right. Right. Like that doesn’t even sound good.

[Sheila] No. Like God is not expecting you to do that. Like God is not looking at you angry at you ladies because you’re not letting your husband use you. And that’s somehow sometimes how we feel and Oh my goodness, that’s such a bad message. You know what God is saying is I created something amazing and I created it for you too. And I want you to experience all of it. And when we see sex as like a duty, I think we’re missing out on it, and we’re not really able to embrace it the way we’re supposed to because always been seen as a negative thing. So how can we see it as a positive thing? So ladies, I want to give you the positive message today.

[Heidi] Hit me, hit me. Sheila, I like the positive message.

[Sheila] Yeah. Like, and I know I’ve shared this on your podcast before, so if any of you heard me like a while ago, you may have heard this before, but I’m going to say it again. I’m going to tell you a story. I was 13 years old and I’m sitting in church and the pastor was reading from Genesis 4 and it was the King James version back then. We didn’t have the NIV, so that makes me sound really dated. But there you go. And, and you know he opened the Bible and he said, and Adam knew his wife Eve and they conceived unto them a son. And I’m sitting there beside all my 13 year old friends and we’re all giggling like the is actually moving because…

[Heidi] I think we might’ve been at same church about the same time.

[Sheila] Yeah. Cause we all think this is the funniest thing in the world, right? Like, like God is embarrassed of saying the real word. But here’s what’s really cool. Okay. I grew up and I looked into that verse and the Hebrew in that verse for Adam knew his wife Eve is the same word that David uses in the Psalms when he says, “search me and know me, oh God,” okay? It’s this deep knowing; this deep longing for intimacy; this deep feeling like you’re totally connected with someone else. And I think the reason that God used that word in Genesis was to tell us that sex is more than just physical. You know? It’s this deep, it’s this spiritual and emotional connection that comes as well. And I know a lot of us don’t feel sex that way for all kinds of different reasons. A lot of us have a lot of baggage and we’ve heard these negative messages, but that’s what God intended. And I think even knowing that’s what God intended is freeing, you know? God intended this to be a deeply intimate thing and not just that—He intended it to be really, really pleasurable. And I’m going to say some words that might cause some people to fall out of their seats. I hope I’m allowed to do that on this podcast.

[Heidi] Yes you are. But I always like to do this because there’s lots of people listening to this. So if you’re listening to this right now, this is your five second warning. If you’re listening to this right now and you’ve got like an eight year old that you’re like, you know what? Let’s have this conversation later. It’s totally fine for you to turn off the podcast, come back and finish it because Sheila and I are going to have a no holds barred conversation, which is the only kind I think to have, especially when we’re talking about something so precious as sex in the culture. So there’s your five-second, I guess it’s been 10 seconds now. All right Sheila, you’re clear. You’re clear for takeoff.

[Sheila] Okay. I want to talk about the theology of the clitoris.

[Heidi] Aren’t you glad we warned you everybody?

[Sheila] Because you know what? This tells us a lot about God. All right, and a lot of what he meant for sex. So let’s think about this for a minute. The clitoris is not inside the vagina. Like why would God do that? Wouldn’t that make a whole lot more sense? Like, because the clitoris is how we feel the majority of pleasure. It’s not actually through intercourse. So that doesn’t mean that you can’t feel good through intercourse. And I get into this a lot in some of my books. I don’t know that we have time to do all of this now.

[Heidi] Well, I can tell you right now because I get letters all the time for women about this. There’s a whole lot of women listening to this right now going “oh, that’s happening.”

[Sheila] Yeah, so, okay. So God made us so that the main focus of our pleasure was outside the vagina. In other words, we weren’t going to get it through intercourse alone. All right? Now some women do, and I know I’m going to be making some generalizations, so excuse me for that. If you don’t quite fit that generalization, doesn’t mean there’s anything wrong with you. There’s a whole lot of variation. But for most women, what we need is so special attention there. And if God made us that way, then that means that he intended for women to be the focus of attention during sex for awhile. Let’s let that sink in for you. Okay? So ladies, if you’re feeling like you are running off your feet trying to get all the shopping done and all the Christmas gifts wrapped and making sure that the stockings have stuff for them and making sure you’ve got your grocery list planned for Christmas dinner.

God knows you’re like that. Like God knows that women are multitaskers. Okay? And so God looked at us and he said, you know what? I want to give women a chance to be the ones who were served, and I want to give women a chance to not multitask, and I want you to be the center of attention. And so he made us so that we would need foreplay so that guys would have to not be selfish and pay attention to us for a bit. And also so that we would have to just connect with our bodies. Because if you are trying to have sex and you’ve got a million things going on in your head, like what kind of cranberry sauce you’re going to serve..

[Heidi] Which is every woman listening to this, right? It’s every busy mom.

[Sheila] Exactly, then you’re not going to be able to enjoy it. Because it doesn’t matter what he does. Our sex drives are so much in our head. So he could be doing, he could be the best lover that well he could do exactly the same thing to you tonight that he did three nights ago that had you in raptures and tonight’s you were lying there thinking will you just get it over with? Because I’ve got Christmas lists to make it, right? It’s not about what he’s doing. And so the only way that we can enjoy ourselves is if we can empty our heads of all the responsibilities we have and just focus on our bodies and focus on our husbands.

[Heidi] Okay, I’m going to stop you. How do we do that? How can we do that, Sheila? How do we stop thinking about what needs to go on the crockpot tomorrow and how our kids didn’t get their homework done and the clothes that are getting moldy in the washing machine. How do we, how do we disconnect that stuff? Because women are multitaskers and I think this is half the problem, right? For 30 years, my husband and I have had lots of conversations about this and there’ve been times I’m like, I know, like I know I don’t seem like I’m just into it because you know the crockpot, like I can’t turn my turn it off. So how do we get from the space being the multitaskers that we are and the people that God has made us to relax and actually enjoy being with our husbands.

[Sheila] Yeah, and I talk about this a lot in my Boost Your Libido course that I’m going to give your listeners a great coupon for that that we’ll talk about at the end of this podcast so that you can get in touch with this. But here’s, here’s a really quick tip. Okay. When you were lying there, I want you to ask yourself what feels good right now? Like what is wanting to be touched really. I know it sounds really stupid, like, and I don’t mean that you’re judging your husband on whether or not he’s doing the right thing, but if you were lying there thinking to yourself when he touches the right place, then I’ll come back to my body. But right now I’m thinking about grocery list. It doesn’t matter what he does, you’re always going to be thinking grocery list.

But if you say to yourself, what needs to be touched right now? You’ll realize, oh my gosh, something’s actually feeling good. And then you can pay attention to that and you can guide him to it. You can talk about it, whatever. But I mean, what God intended ladies, was that your husband has to focus on you and that you don’t have to multitask. And let me tell you something. A lot of us feel like there’s something wrong with us because we need foreplay. And so we rushed through it because we think, Oh, he must be bored of this, or he must be getting tired or his hand must be hurting or whatever is hurting. And he must think that I’m frigid. And all of that. And yet the average guy can have an orgasm in three minutes. The average woman takes 22 that’s how God designed you. And there’s nothing wrong with you ladies. It’s just the God wants you to get a chance to just relax and be the center of attention.

[Heidi] Well, and don’t you think like, here… I got another question for you. You’re my own private doctor with this. So I got another question for you. So when you talk about this with women, and you say the women are saying, man, I wonder if my husband’s board, whatever. I’ve only ever had experience with one man. I’ve been married to my husband for a long time and we were both virgins when we got married. And so we grew in this area obviously together. But I can tell you, most of the women I talk to and I travel all over the country. I’ve had the same experience as me, which is your husband intrinsically does not want you to lay there and be bored and hate what’s happening. He wants you to be engaged. He wants to know that he’s doing something right. And so a lot of this just negative self talk. And what I hear you saying is you got to be intentional about even directing your thoughts. You’ve got to be intention about what directing your thoughts. You’ve got to be intentional about communicating, which is so hard for most of the women I talk to because they are so easy to understand and we are so much more complicated. Truly.

[Sheila] We are and our sex drives are more complicated. But again, that’s the way that God made us, you know? And that doesn’t mean there’s something wrong with us. I think part of the problem is we tend to think about sex and men’s terms. Like if you ask someone when’s the last time you had sex? Or have you ever had sex? The way that we define sex is man puts his thing there, right? You know, inside her and he moves around until he gets released. And that tends to be the definition of sex. But if you notice in that definition, she’s not doing anything. Her pleasure isn’t even included in that definition. And what I want to encourage us is to think of sex in a totally different way. The way that God intended it, where it isn’t just about him moving around until he climaxes. That’s intercourse, okay? But sex is this experience that you share together that is about both of you, and if in your relations, like, when when God talks about do not deprive each other, he doesn’t just mean let your husband use you because if that’s the case, you’re the one being deprived, okay? Like what He wants is for you guys to have this mutual thing where it’s good for both of you.

And I know it’s not good for a lot of you right now. I’m not naive and I’m not trying to paint too happy a picture. I totally understand that 36% of women have never or very rarely reach orgasm. I know that there’s a whole ton of marriages where porn has played a huge part and where he’s not even interested in foreplay. Like I know that there’s a lot of issues, but I really think that if we can see this in the correct way, we can start having some of those good conversations with our husbands about, “Hey, first of all, I’m not tolerating this. If you’re watching porn, that’s not happening.”

[Heidi] Yeah, and you can camp on that for just a second because this is actually coming. You know I live here in Washington state and OSPI which is the Office of Superintendent for Public Instruction. They are actually, this is really, really happy. You guys can Google it. I’m not even lying to you. They are introducing children to porn.

[Sheila] What?

[Heidi] Yes. Starting next year, and actually I was in a meeting about it last night and I’ll talk about at the end of the show notes for your people who are here locally, but very important for parents to understand, porn ruins men. It ruins men. It ruins marriages. It will absolutely ruin children.

[Sheila] Yep.

[Heidi] And we shouldn’t tolerate it. I got a letter from a woman a couple of weeks ago and she said, well, her husband needed porn to become aroused. And I was like, eh, like something’s already so, so, so wrong in that marriage. So talk to the woman whose husband is either, like, she would say he was a casual viewer of porn and they’ve just decided, well, this is what makes our marriage exciting. Can you talk to her?

[Sheila] Yeah. So wrong. So what porn does is it rewires the brain, so that twists what’s arousing is an image or an idea rather than a person. And it actually changes the whole arousal process so that you can no longer get aroused by a relationship. So it’s not about whether you were a supermodel or not, it wouldn’t matter. The fact is you’re a person. And so that means that he can’t get aroused by you. Porn is the number one cause of sexual dysfunction today. You know, a guy is suffering erectile dysfunction, premature ejaculation, delayed ejaculation, a lot of that is porn induced. Let’s remember too, porn is heavily impact, like implicated in sex trafficking. This is not something that’s harmless. The majority of porn today is violent. Those are real women getting raped and even if they’re so called “consenting,” most of them are high or else they’re victims of childhood sex abuse themselves. And porn is increasing child sex trafficking around the globe. So this is something that we cannot tolerate.

[Heidi] Yeah. I read an article last week, I believe it is, from a girl, one of the principal players in the series of just finished called Game of Thrones, which I haven’t talked about on the podcast over here, but it just, the whole thing disgusts me because we have normalized it and she was talking about the scenes in that particular show where she was raped. She said that she cried through all of it. She had to drink to get through all of it. And I’m sitting there thinking, we’ve glorified this in the culture and here’s this woman. I mean, obviously you can say, well, she made the choice to do that. Yes, she could’ve said, Nope, I’m sorry I’m out. She didn’t. But she said how much damage it had done to her in that moment. And these women are having- they are being abused. And many times she wasn’t, but many women being trafficked for what we think is the pleasure of people who are viewing this stuff. And it’s hurt on both sides. The person who views it and the person who produces it.

[Sheila] Yeah, and 30% of porn users are women, so it’s messing us up as well. But here’s what’s happened. So you get a guy from most marriages today, for millennial marriages, a guy’s porn habit predates the marriage, so he was already using porn beforehand. And what we often hear people say is, so just have more sex and then he won’t need the porn. Or if you have sex a lot, he won’t be so tempted towards porn. That’s not true at all. It has nothing to do with you. It honestly doesn’t. The problem is that what porn trains him to do is to get aroused by an image. Then he doesn’t want you as much. Or even if he does, he has to use porn to get aroused, and that’s wrong. But the other thing is that what we’ve been talking about in porn, there is no foreplay.

Okay?

[Heidi] Right.

[Sheila] Women are aroused by stuff that’s vicious and violent and brutal and often just very fast and she likes it supposedly. And so here he is, you get these two virgins who get married perhaps or very little sexual experience. He’s grown up with porn and so he has no idea that she needs foreplay and she doesn’t really understand that she does or if he tries, it’s very cursory. And then sex feels terrible for her. He thinks she’s frigid because she’s not reacting the way the porn stars do. She thinks she’s frigid because she’s supposed to like sex, and sex is intercourse. And so they both think she’s frigid, he gets mad at her, she gets mad at herself and she just wants to forget the whole thing.

Right? It’s just a huge, huge mess. And so if porn has stolen your sex life from you as a couple, then stop the porn, tell him this won’t be tolerated, but then reclaim sex. You know, and that’s going to take a while. That’s going to take a huge process because he needs to relearn intimacy. And that’s probably a topic for a whole different podcast. But whatever the reason, whether it’s porn or whether it’s not understanding their own sexuality or whatever. Like if sex is not been good up until this point, that’s okay, but don’t believe that what’s happened in the past is to be what happens in the future.

[Heidi] Mm, it so good. That’s right.

[Sheila] And if God made something to be this amazing, then don’t miss out on it. You know, make it the most fun research project you’re going to do this year. Like make this your goal for 2020.

[Heidi] A good goal.

[Sheila] That we are going to have amazing sex. And even if you’ve never experienced that before. I talk about this a lot in my Boost Your Libido course, and in a lot of my books on how you can get there because it wasn’t great for me. It was terrible for the first few years. I totally get it, but we figured it out and I’m glad we did it.

[Heidi] What we’re doing too, I think as mothers, if I can touch on that aspect for just a second, what we’re doing is we’re setting the tone for our own daughters and for how they will view themselves when they get married one day. And we want them to go into marriage with a healthy perspective on sex and to have it be something they look forward to, not something that they dread. And so often, our daughters hear, at least I heard this growing up, you know what a chore, exactly what you said at the very beginning. And we want to be sure that our children know that sex is precious and that God made it to be enjoyed by both a husband and a wife inside of a marriage. And you’ve done a really great job of bringing that home.

Talk to the mom for just a minute who is listening to you. You have a great course, and we’re going to link back to in the show notes today. It’s Boost Your Libido. You guys can get 20% off if you use the coupon code “busymom” today, and we’ll link back to how to do that in the show notes today, but to that mom who feels she’s just, she’s like, I don’t even know; we’ve been married for so long or we’re in this rut. I don’t even know if we can ever get out of it. Can you talk to her? Is there hope for that mom?

[Sheila] There always is and believe me, God did not make your body wrong. Like if you have never, if sex has never felt good for you, it’s something that you can get over. It’s going to take communication and that means being vulnerable with your husband. That’s a bit of a scary thing, but it is so worth it because God wants you to feel passion. I think the whole reason that he created passion was so that we could get a glimpse of what it’s like to feel out of control and utterly in love all at the same time. Because isn’t that the picture of the Christian life? You know that we’re supposed to be a little bit out of control with God and very much in love. And then he made sex to mirror that. This is something he feels deeply about and that he wants us to experience.

And it’s something which when it goes well, it relaxes you. It becomes this kind of foundation for your whole family because when you feel close to your husband, when you feel invigorated and energized and you’re making all these funny jokes with him and you’re relaxed with him, like everything else in your life tends to go great. And this is a blessing and a gift for you. So please don’t see the gift as just something on your to do list. Like embrace the gift. And one of the things that I’m really passionate about is trying to figure out what’s gone on with women that we don’t see it as a gift. And so I’m actually in the middle of conducting the largest survey that’s ever been done of Christian women, the most comprehensive survey of Christian women’s sex lives. And if you all could help me, that would be amazing. Cause then we can get some good information and we can teach our daughters this right.

[Heidi] Yes. Yeah. It’s so important. I’m going to link back to that survey in the show notes today for those of you who want to help, and I hope that a lot of you will answer this because it is so important. How long, so let’s say there’s a woman listening to this and she’s like, yeah, I would like to give you my feedback. How long is it going to take her to, when she starts that survey from the time she finishes it? So that she doesn’t think, Oh this is a 30 second survey.

[Sheila] Yeah, it’s actually quite comprehensive. It is 20 minutes long. Most people are actually getting through to the end though. It’s not a boring survey. Okay. It’s interesting.

[Heidi] Well, we’re talking about sex. It can’t be that boring.

[Sheila] Yeah, but I’ll tell ya, this information, I’ve already got three book contracts on it, and we’re going to get even more. We’re going to be talking to pastors about how to teach women about sex, how to talk about it in a healthier way. All kinds of stuff like this can really be groundbreaking, but what we need is we need, we’ve got 18,000 women so far. I would just love to get to 25,000 by Christmas because the more data we have, the better this is going to be. So if you’re married, if you’ve ever been married, even if you’re divorced, we really need you. So please take the survey. It’s just going to help so much. The survey does close December 31st, so if you’re listening to this podcast later on, it might be closed by then, but please help us out if you can.

[Heidi] I love it. And then you’ve got an awesome course for the mom who just like, she really wants to see sex as a gift, but she’s lost her libido. She’s exhausted. You know, so many of the women who are listening to this right now can relate, and honestly I bet you anything, there’s a bunch of men going, “that’s my wife, that’s my wife and I want her back” They’re thinking who took my wife’s sex drive? So they can get 20% off of your course, Boost Your Libido, and you guys use the coupon code “busymom” and I will link back to that in the show notes today.

[Sheila] And here’s something fun too. If you buy it before Christmas, I will email you some little coupons. You can print it and put it in his stocking just to let him know that you’re taking it. And that can be kind of like a Christmas gift for your husband.

[Heidi] Hello, that’s a fantastic idea, you guys. The reason that I’m willing to engage in conversations like this at the podcast is because I feel so passionately that the world has really taken what God made to be beautiful and good and perverted it and made it something that’s devastating and even dangerous in many cases. And Christians, those of us who know the Lord Jesus and know that we have a creator, my husband’s always saying, Christian married couples should be having the best sex of anybody because we can with reckless abandon say thank you Lord, thank you father for this gift and we’re going to enjoy it. And it’s something that you guys can unwrap together this Christmas, right, Sheila?

[Sheila] Absolutely. Yes and wouldn’t that make it a wonderful Christmas night? I think.

[Heidi] I think so. I think so too. Ladies, you gotta get your stuff done. Okay, so don’t bring all of your wrapping Christmas, you know, garbage into your bedroom because that’s just even more distracting, right? We’re busy as it is, but this is worth investing in, and sex is precious, and it’s worth protecting. And so Sheila Gregoire, where I thank you so much for coming on the show. It is always a joy to have you and to hear your voice encouraging women to see sex the way God sees it.

[Sheila] Well, thank you for having me and thank you in advance to everyone who fills out that survey. You are so needed, and I really appreciate you.

[Heidi] All right, awesome. For more information on the survey, and also if you’re interested in getting a 20% off of the Boost Your Libido course, which I know you are guys, if you want to help get this for your wife for Christmas, I don’t think, don’t get her a vacuum cleaner. I mean unless she said, “I really want a vacuum cleaner,” just don’t do that. She has to actually ask for the vacuum cleaner, but I hope you guys will go to the website and check it out. You can find everything related to this conversation and Sheila Gregoire and her ministry to married couples at heidistjohn.com/podcast.

If you guys have questions for me, I would love to hear from you. You can submit those questions at heidistjohn.com/mailbox Monday and again, keep those Christmas cards coming. I’m loving hearing from you. You’re encouraging the families here at the Firmly Planted Family homeschool resource center, and if you can include a year end donation to the nonprofit that helps us keep this podcast on the air year-round, and you can make those checks out to Firmly Planted Family, which is the nonprofit organization. We love you guys. We thank you so much for listening. We have a fantastic weekend with your husbands. Listen, hey, you guys get a head start on all the stuff we’ve been talking about. Nothing wrong with that. Have a fantastic weekend you guys and I’ll see you back here on Monday.

Write to [Heidi]
Heidi St. John
c/o Firmly Planted Family
11100 NE 34th Cir, Vancouver, WA 98682

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