Recently, contemporary Christian music artist Lauren Daigle fumbled her way through what is arguable THE question that the church is grappling with: “Is homosexuality a sin?” But what if we all were ready to give an answer? Join Heidi today as she turns our attention to the our own responsibility to know and share the hope we have in Jesus with the world.
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Hey Everybody, this is Heidi St. John! Welcome to the Heidi St. John podcast!
Today is Monday, December 10th – it’s episode number 699. I have gotten so many emails, and Facebook messages, and Instagram posts from those of you who have been wanting me to comment on the recent interview that Lauren Daigle gave to a radio show about homosexuality. It’s a pretty deep topic, but I think it bears talking about so stick around, I think you’re going to be encouraged.
All right you guys. We got a lot of stuff to talk about today. Before I jump into it, I want to say hi to everybody who is listening to this in the shower because I keep hearing from you – so rinse your hair. 🙂
It is a joy for me to be coming into your homes, and into your hearts, three days a week. I want to thank you so much for leaving reviews for this podcast over at iTunes, for sharing it. God is doing an incredible work here at the podcast. It really is my heart and the heart of my husband to see a generation of women actually become strong in the Lord and in the power of His might. It’s really are going to be talking about today. Obviously what Lauren Daigle said is going to be the topic of our conversation.
But honestly, every single one of us has a platform. We all have a responsibility – and I want to encourage you to know the word of God for yourself. It’s the reason why we started MomStrong International. We’re coming up on 10,000 members there. It’s our goal to get to that point by the end of the year and you can help us do that – simply by sharing what’s happening over at MomStrong International. Talk to people about the FREE Scripture Writing community that’s there and we hope that you guys will join us.
We are so excited about what God is doing. He’s doing an incredible work. And He does it as we come together and decide – hey, we’re going to be the people that God says we are. We’re not going to listen anymore to what the world says. We’re not going to take our identity from what the world says – rather we’re going to take it from the Word of God and we’re going to see ourselves the way that God sees us. So that’s what I want to encourage you to do today.
All right. It’s been in the news all over the place. You had to be living under a rock if you haven’t been hearing about Lauren Daigle. So several weeks ago Lauren, who is a prolific Christian music writer – she’s got an incredible voice – very much like Adele. I could listen to her all day long. I actually love her music.
I heard that she was going to be going on the Ellen DeGeneres show. And unlike some of my critics, I actually thought that was great. I love to see her embrace the people around her in the way that God would have her due. To use her platform to share the love of God with people. And we need to be very careful, men and women, before we start judging people who don’t know the Lord and are outside the church.
In 1 Corinthians 5:12-18, The Bible says (this is the NIV)
What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?
That’s what we’re gonna hang on to today at 1 Corinthians 5:12.
What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?
So I keep hearing people say, you know – don’t judge lest you be judged. You guys have heard me talk about this before It’s a terrible misuse of that verse. We are called to righteous judgment. But you can’t hold somebody to account for sin, particularly when it’s a sin that God’s word speaks against – so clearly like homosexuality but the culture has absolutely embraced it.
How can we expect someone to believe that what God says is sin if they don’t have the power of the Holy Spirit? So for Lauren Daigle, to get on the Ellen DeGeneres show – you guys I’m praying for Ellen DeGeneres.
She’s hilarious for one thing, ridiculously talented – I’d love to see her come to faith in the Lord Jesus. She would have an incredible story to tell of God’s redemptive power in her life. So I hope that we’re praying for her. We should be.
You shouldn’t condemn somebody for going on her show. I actually don’t understand the condemnation coming from the Christian community that way. We love to be Pharisees, we do.
I read a book a long time ago called Twelve Steps For A Recovering Pharisee Like Me. And I loved it because the author of that book was so clearly saying – we got issues. The church has issues. And unfortunately, Lauren Daigle – you know, she should have prepared for this. You know she was interviewed after that, predictably. And of course, people want to know what do you think about homosexuality.
So she is on The Domenick Nati Show, or Nadi – however, he says his name – and she offered her comments as to whether or not she believed that homosexuality is a sin.
Now listen, this woman has enjoyed a whole lot of mainstream success in recent years because she’s ridiculously talented, and she struggled with this question.
So they asked her just point blank: Do you feel that homosexuality is a sin? And here’s what she said: “You know, I can’t honestly answer on that.”
She said adding that she had “too many people I love” that “are homosexual”. But she didn’t stop there. “I don’t know” – she went on to say “I actually had a conversation with someone last night about it”. She continued, “I can’t say one way or the other. I’m not God. So when people ask a question like that that’s what my go to is like. Like, I just say read the Bible and find out for yourself. And when you find out let me know because I’m learning too.”
All right. So a couple of things. I agree with her – she said that she had been deeply saddened that people criticized her for appearing on a show that was hosted by someone who’s openly homosexual.
I was also sad about that because for me she had an opportunity. She sang about the gospel on that show. I was thrilled. I was like – Get after it girl. Go for it.
But I will say I’m very disappointed in her answer, And I don’t want to make this about Lauren so much today as I want to make it about us. Because every single one of us, including myself – every single person listening to this, every teenager, every father, every mother, every grandmother, every single one of you has been given influence.
You have influence with your family, you have influence with the people that you work with, and the Bible says that we are called to give an answer for the hope that lies within us. And I was disappointed to Lauren’s answer mostly because she said she “can’t answer that”
Well if you know your Bible you can answer it. It is not a hard question. And I think we would do ourselves a favor as believers if we would stop making these questions about us. This question isn’t about Lauren Daigle. It’s about the Word of God. It’s about what God says in His Word. And so when she said – “I can’t honestly answer that” – I was like – Oh Lauren, yes you can! Read your Bible!
She doesn’t have to say “Well I think homosexuality is a sin”. What she should have said was “well God says it’s a sin just like He says adultery is a sin, and greed is a sin, and lust is a sin, and lying is a sin.
Unfortunately, in the culture, we’ve elevated homosexuality in the Christian community to be like – THE sin.
So now we have to argue about it. But the Bible says that all of our sin separates us from God, that without the sacrifice of Jesus, that all of our righteousness is as filthy rags toward God. We are separated by sin, all kinds of sin, of which homosexuality is clearly one. And I keep hearing people trying to make theological arguments for homosexuality. Listen you guys have to do theological and doctrinal backflips to say that homosexuality is not a sin. It is. Read Romans for goodness sake.
Read the book of Romans, start with Romans 1. And you don’t need me to help you read it. Read it for yourself. I do appreciate that she said go read your Bible. I kind of want to say to Lauren – you should read your Bible too before you get on.
She knew she was going to be asked that question. It’s a very simple question to answer. It’s a very simple question to answer.
I posted a quote by Rich Mullins on my Facebook page the other day and I said – why are we so surprised at Lauren Daigle struggled to stand up for the truth amidst the crushing pressure of celebrity? And it is crushing. She has used her platform many times to announce the Lord. This was nothing different, except for – I think she really did buckle under the pressure of celebrity. It’s tough when you’re in that situation, so I can have grace for her – listen to what Rich Mullins said.
I think he said it best. He said, and I’m quoting now:
It’s so funny being a Christian musician. It always scares me when people think so highly of Christian music, Contemporary Christian music especially. Because I kind of go, I know a lot of us, and we don’t know jack about anything. Not that I don’t want you to buy our records or come to our concerts. I sure do. But you should come for entertainment. If you really want scriptural nourishment, you should go to church…you should read the Scriptures.
And that’s really what I want to encourage you to do. Read your Bible. It’s time for us to stop looking to contemporary Christian musicians as theologians because we keep getting let down over and over again. And because the world esteems that kind of celebrity, we’re gonna keep looking to these people. And I just wanna encourage you – if you’ve got a platform – know your Bible. You’ve got to know your Bible.
Had they took direct aim at that Lauren Daigle in in her question in the question that they posed to her and her perplexing response has sort of set the Christian world on fire – and I think it doesn’t need to do that.
I think we can look each other go – wow that was a lesson for every single one of us.
There’s another young man, a colleague, who wasn’t afraid to call sin sin and rebuke compromise publicly. He posted this on his Facebook page. He said:
“So Christians everywhere are apparently upset with Lord Daigle because she didn’t stand up for truth, but the problem is that they just can’t seem to remember the last time they did either. People are writing to me everywhere today because in many circles I’m known as a prophet who speaks out with boldness courage. Pastors and saints are asking me to come out tonight and blast Lauren Daigle. Well I’ve been in prayer about it all day and I feel absolutely zero unction from the Holy Ghost to address Lauren Daigle. I feel tremendous unction to address the hypocrisy in the body of Christ.”
And I kind of – I am disappointed with Lauren – but I do agree with this young man. Because unless we’ve been in that situation ourselves we really don’t have any idea how we’d perform. But we need to know the Word so that we can be – what? Ready. We want to be ready.
I guess I’m disappointed because I feel like she should have been ready because she knew that that question – surely that was gonna be asked of her. But we don’t know. Maybe God wants to use her voice to bring hope and healing and faith to a hurting world. The messages in her song are wonderful. Her voice is angelic. God is using her, let’s continue to pray for her.
I would hate to see her become another casualty of the Christian culture wars. And we can certainly take a lesson from Lauren. And I think the lesson is – we need to be ready. We need to be ready to give an answer for the hope that lies within us.
I think the enemy would love to see us jumping on the train, but I’d rather we learned a lesson from it, and we pray for her. God has given her a platform and I just, I pray to God that she knows His word and that she can rightly defend it when the hard questions come. And they will come. And they’re gonna come for every single one of you. And I know that a lot of you have written questions to me about this particular episode and this happens all the time, right?
I talked about a book written by a very popular artist right now, an author rather. And I did a podcast on it several months ago talking about her – basically, she was talking about her love for diversity and tolerance, and that’s our jam, and blah blah blah.
And I’m so concerned because I’m watching these people get out there and they talk about Christianity. Really their books are secular. We read it and we don’t have the discernment to say – that’s actually a secular book. We’re not going back to the Word of God. Which brings me to a question that I’m an address from Mailbox Monday really quickly from a listener. And she said –
Heidi my husband and I left the Methodist Church two years ago, prompted by the Holy Spirit, after seeing what’s happening at the national level – beginning to have such a significant trickle down effect in our small town country church. We found a wonderful non denominational Bible based church that God uses to rock our world. But a friend who still attends a Methodist Church recommended a book for our book club. It’s called Everybody Always by Bob Goff. I researched him before beginning the book.
OK so first of all – hats off to you. This is what we should be doing. So whether it’s Heidi St. John that writes a book or Bob Goff writes a book — we should be researching, find out who these people are. So she says:
I researched him before beginning the book after learning that the local Methodist church was using it for their Sunday morning small group study class. I finished chapter one, glanced at the rest of book – can’t find one lick of Scripture in the whole stinking book. The goal he states is “What I’m trying to do right now is make my faith simple”
And so this listener writes:
My question is – how does an author explain or discuss faith without any scripture, including only vague references to the Bible?
So, here’s the thing, sweet girl, and I appreciate you writing this. Here’s the thing -this is the culture that we find ourselves in in right now. We we want to talk about our faith to make it “simple”. What we’re doing is we’re watering down the truth of the Word of God in order to make it palatable to the culture.
And anytime you see someone do that – it worries me. I did read Everybody Always and that would be a book I would probably give someone who didn’t know the Lord who – maybe was interested in faith. And I love the message of his book. I love his attitude. There were a lot of things I liked about I agree with you. Not very good representation of scripture. If your goal is to study scripture. But I don’t really think that was his goal.
I was asked several years ago to speak for a conference (wasn’t a Christian conference) and they asked me – hey, could you please not proselytize. You know, we think you’re a great speaker we want you to talk about marriage and family, but we really don’t want you to give an altar call or anything like that.
And I’d been hired by these people. And so I said – absolutely I can do that – but boy I’ll tell you what you guys – I went to prayer before it. I was like, Father help me! I don’t know how to do this without You. I can’t. I can’t. Everything about my life is awash with Scripture, everything.
I don’t how people do this world without Jesus. Really, apart from Him, we don’t have any wisdom except for what the world offers us – and for goodness sake look around! It’s not helping. And the Lord so clearly said – you are the fragrance of Christ, be the fragrance of Christ. How do we how do we start being the fragrance of Christ? They’ll know we’re Christians by our love.
Which brings me back to the verse that we started off with this morning in 1 Corinthians 5:12.
What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church?
We are called to judge those inside the church. That’s why the criticism of Lauren Daigle, that’s why the criticism of so many these Christian authors who are giving kind of a watered down version of the truth of the word of God.
But I want us to be careful that we reserve our judgment until after we’ve really said – Father open my eyes. What am I missing? They’ll know we’re Christians by our love.
I’m hoping that every single one of us that’s listening to this, myself included – because I’ll tell you what — even for somebody with a smaller platform like mine, the pressure is enormous. It’s enormous.
I get hate mail on a regular basis. People have threatened my life because of my stand for the Lord Jesus. I can’t even imagine being in Lauren Daigle shoes. What would happen to her? And I don’t know what went on in her mind. Maybe she doesn’t know the Word of God, I don’t know. But I’m going to pray for her because she has platform. And we are called to be salt and light, to speak the truth in love, not to water it down.
And so I just want to encourage you – rather than just turning the spotlight on everybody else all the time – can we also shine it on our own lives? What are we doing in the privacy of our homes? How are you guys dealing with the things that you’re watching on Netflix? and with the number of glasses of wine that you’re having with your dinner?
We make so many excuses and we love to judge other people – but I’m telling you what – the Lord has been so strongly reminding me, especially this Christmas season — it starts with me.
Your witness starts with you. If you want your kids to walk with the Lord, if you want people around you to see God at work in you – walk with them. He doesn’t want to be an accessory to your life. He wants to be your life. And so before we look to Christian celebrities, or Christian music artists, or Christian authors – we should look to God’s Word. God is still at work.
I’ve been watching, as many of you have over the last week, the funeral service for George Herbert Walker Bush. Looking over his life, and his marriage, and his legacy now. And it’s interesting to me to note that the thing that he said gave him the greatest joy – wasn’t an accomplishment, it wasn’t meeting with the world leader, it wasn’t being president – it was knowing that his kids were having an impact.
An really, God wants us to walk in right relationship with Him so that we can share the Gospel. Our lives should share the Gospel.
I heard it quoted once that we should share the Gospel all the time – and if necessary, use words. And I want my life to be like that. So before we end the podcast today I’m going to go ahead and pray for all of us, myself included, because this world is not our home. We’re just passing through and God wants to walk with us every step of the way until we step into glory. and we hear – Well done.
So would you bow your heads in prayer with me?
Lord Jesus, I thank you for Lauren Daigle. I thank you for the platform that you’ve given her. Father would you be with her? Would you give her your words? She clearly has your heart for the lost and she’s got the love piece right. And Lord, as we talk about standing up in the culture, and speaking the truth, and and being an ambassador for you – Lord I pray that we would all get the whole piece right. It’s the truth in love any other way is not your way – but I pray that you give me boldness and temper it with love, and mercy, and kindness. Father thank you for every person that’s listening to this podcast right now, every single person who’s within earshot of my voice.
Lord, would your Holy Spirit just convict us. Lord, show us the areas of our lives that we need to be more like you. I thank you for the opportunity you’ve given us, Lord, to speak the truth. I thank you for social media. I thank you for the many places that we have opportunity to be salt and light, and Lord – I pray you’d help us do it.
Lord we love you, we want to honor you with our lives and with our words – so Father, to quote your Word
Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in your sight, O LORD, our rock, and our redeemer. [Psalm 19:14]
Thanks for listening everybody, today to the podcast! I want to remind you to head on over to MomStrongInternational.com – we just started a brand new week – it’s called In Search of Joy. We have revamped the Bible Study – I think you’re going to love it! You can start a MomStrong Group in your home, you can start one in your church, you can study it by yourself. Either way, we want to help you get into God’s Word and encourage the people around you to know His Word betterm and to walk in right relationship with God.
Thanks for listening everybody and I’ll see you back here on Wednesday!