When Christians notice drag queens in the library, or hear that P&G is removing the feminine symbol from the Always brand of women’s sanitary products, or learn that their child’s schools are opening girls’ bathrooms to biological males, what are we to do? The answer lies in the Bible. We are to not just curse the darkness, but proclaim the light. We should be a voice of truth and reason and oppose things that are bad for children, bad for society, etc, BUT we must also be demonstrating in word and deed what is GOOD for society. Join me today for a lively conversation with my friend James Gottry, who serves as the vice president of public policy for the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.
Transcribed version of podcast is below.
Today’s Scripture Writing Challenge Verse
- Matthew 11:28-30
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My bio is pasted below:
James Gottry serves as vice president of public policy for the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. In this role, he leads the effort to monitor current events and legislative measures that impact the institution of the family and culture, interpret them in light of the Bible, and provide appropriate strategies for response.
Married 13 yrs and he and his wife are currently homeschooling 8,6,5,3 yr old in Colorado springs
Gottry also writes about constitutional law, religious freedom, and cultural issues, and his work has been published in The Wall Street Journal, Fox News, National Review, The Hill, Christian Post, The Daily Wire, Public Discourse, The Federalist, The Daily Signal, and various additional print and online outlets. He has appeared on MSNBC and has been quoted by USA Today, NPR, Fox News, and others. Gottry is an experienced presenter and has spoken to audiences across the country.
Prior to joining JDFI, Gottry was the director of marketing and legal counsel with Alliance Defending Freedom. At ADF, Gottry led the marketing and communication efforts to engage ADF allies, supporters, and participants in ADF training programs, among other groups.
Gottry also has worked as an associate at Snell & Wilmer, LLP, where he focused on commercial litigation with an emphasis in construction, financial services, and general business torts and contract-related disputes. He successfully defended clients in both federal and state court and in administrative proceedings.
Gottry earned his J.D. from Vanderbilt University Law School in 2011, where he was elected to the Order of the Coif and served as senior en banc editor of the Vanderbilt Law Review. Before graduating from law school, he completed the ADF leadership development program to become a Blackstone Fellow in 2009. He obtained a B.A. in public relations from Northern Arizona University in 1999.
Don’t Miss These!
Hey everybody, this is Heidi St. John. Welcome to the podcast. Happy New Year, you guys. Happy New Year to everybody. This is episode number 867. It is Friday, January 3rd. It’s Meet My Friend Friday and I have just an incredible guest on the show with me today and we’re going to talk about all things faith and culture. Let’s kick off the new year right. Stick around, I think you’re going to be encouraged.
Thanks for tuning in today, you guys. Thanks to everybody who sent Christmas cards from all around the world to us here at Firmly Planted Family. We have been so encouraged by what God is doing in your life and we want to keep that up. We’ve got a brand new study just starting at MomStrong International. We’ve changed the format for you to more of a daily study and I think you guys are going to love it. One of the goals that we have for you here at the podcast is to get you into God’s word so that you can study it to show yourselves an approved workman who doesn’t need to be ashamed, who can rightly divide God’s word, and give an accurate representation of the Gospel first to your children and then to the world around you.
If you haven’t joined us yet, this is a great time of year to do it. January, for goodness sake. I want to encourage you to make a commitment to studying the word with me this year. Check it out at momstronginternational.com. All right, I am excited today. It’s Meet My Friend Friday and you guys know I love to have people on here who are really out there in the culture and they’re making a difference for the Lord and for the Gospel and my guest today is no exception. James Gottrey has served as Vice-President of Public Policy for the James Dobson Family Institute. In his role, what he’s doing, is leading the effort to monitor current events and legislative measures that impact the institution of the family and culture, and then interpret them in the light of the Bible and provide appropriate strategies for response. This guy is going to be one of the best-loved guests on my show. I just know it. He’s been married for 13 years and he and his beautiful wife are currently homeschooling their four children in Colorado Springs. James, welcome to the podcast.
[James] Heidi, thank you for having me. It’s a thrill to be here.
[Heidi] Well, it’s thrilling for me to have you here. I was reading your bio, and we were talking about this a few minutes ago, when my staff called and said, “You got to meet this guy,” and they start sending me little snippets. Everything I read, I was like, “Oh man. Oh, that’s awesome.” Just to see somebody who represents the Lord out in the culture is just so exciting for me to see you guys off the bench and onto the battlefield. I love Dr. Dobson. I’ve been on his show several times. I love to see the continuing work over there. You guys have a pretty broad focus. I mean, you’re focusing on the culture at large and how it impacts families, and really there’s nothing going on in the culture right now that doesn’t impact the family.
[James] That’s true. I mean, that is so much front and center, the battle is really at our front door. As Christian families, everything is pointing at us right now and the question is just, “Are we going to be willing to respond?”
[Heidi] Yeah, that’s right. One of the things that I talk to parents about all the time, and a theme of the podcast, has been this idea of getting off the bench and onto the battlefield. I think the reason why, one of the reasons why, there are lots of reasons, but one of the reasons why we’re struggling so much in the culture right now is because Christians have divorced themselves from public policy. We’ve divorced ourselves from politics in general. We don’t like to hurt anybody’s feelings so we tip-toe around things that end up having tremendous impact in the culture. One of the things that you guys are doing so well is highlighting this need for Christians to live out their faith beyond the four walls of their home and their church. I’m curious to know how you’re implementing that and what’s driving it.
[James] Sure. Well, first of all, I mean, you nailed it. Because we hear so often from Christians, we hear them say, “You know what? Hey, I’m okay with talking about the Gospel, but I don’t want to talk about hot button issues like same-sex marriage or abortion or gender identity or human sexuality or school choice or euthanasia or health care or immigration. I just want to talk about the Gospel-“
[Heidi] All the things that … Yeah, these are the building blocks of human existence.
[James] Right? But what does the Gospel mean? The Gospel means good news. I mean, do you think the Bible has good news for us about some of those issues? Do you think it has good news for us about our inherent value as humans from our mother’s womb all the way to natural death? Or how God has uniquely made men and women. I mean, we have the information, we have the wisdom, we have the truth from God’s word and we’re not sharing it.
[Heidi] Yeah, that’s right. I feel like what we’ve seen in the culture in recent years, and by recent, I mean, let’s say 15 years ago, maybe even 20 years ago, is we have started to see fear creep into the church and we’re afraid. We’re afraid of losing our 501C3, for goodness sake. I have had pastors tell me that they are unwilling to address the topic of abortion in their churches because it’s a controversial issue and it just breaks my heart. I thought, “Man, when are we going to stand in agreement with God?” Because isn’t that the issue?
[James] That’s absolutely the issue. You know what? Jesus wasn’t afraid to get controversial and we need to be willing to do the same. When you’re talking about something as basic as the sanctity of human life, if you have pastors saying, “We can’t talk about that.” First of all, that’s a shame. Second of all, we as the body of Christ need to say, “Well, you know what? We will and we need to lead the way.”
[Heidi] That’s right. Yeah. This is really why the Dobson Policy Center exists. I would love it, because this is the first time I’ve had you on the show, and the people that are listening to the show, I’ve been talking about stuff like this for years so this is going to be right in their wheelhouse. So, can you explain about the creation of the Dobson Policy Center and what you’re doing there before we jump into some of these hot button issues?
[James] Absolutely. Well, having been a guest so many times on Dr. Dobson’s show, you know about his love for family. And what Dr. Dobson also often explains is that his love for family motivates his commitment to public policy, and motivates his commitment to being engaged in the culture. That’s really why the policy center exists. It’s to equip individuals and families to impact the culture for Christ. We have this platform because of the 40 plus years of Dr. Dobson’s faithful ministry. We have a platform to speak to millions of believers. Then we have, again because of his faithfulness, the credibility to comment on policies and issues that relate to faith and the family. That’s what we try to do. Whether that’s through commentary or through resources or through collaborative partnerships with people like you, Heidi. We want to envision and equip those Christian families to build their lives on the principles of God’s word, and then to live those out, not just in the home, but also in the public square.
[Heidi] Yeah. this is so important because we have been gifted and called to be representatives and ambassadors of God in every aspect of our lives, so it has to go beyond the four walls of our home. It certainly needs to come out of our churches and get into the culture. I know I live in the Pacific Northwest and you can go into downtown Portland on any given day and just walk down the streets of Portland and a lot of the churches are waving the gay flag now. We’ve taken even down the Christian flag, we waving the gay flag and it’s like, “My goodness. We have allowed really deception and wickedness to infiltrate our churches and it’s turning the church on its head.” There needs to be men and women who know God’s word. This is why Bible study is so important to me, to know God’s word and then say, “Hey, how can I live out this ambassadorship that I have been called to live out?” And really, that’s what you guys are training people to do, is to live out their role as a believer in the world around them.
[James] That’s exactly right. You mentioned earlier, you talked about really the fear that is gripping many Christians. I think as a result, in some ways we’ve gone into this defensive posture where either we don’t say anything or we just point our fingers at the things that are wrong out there but we don’t offer hope. We don’t offer something better. We have that obligation to be salt and to be light. Salt is preservative, but it also gives flavor. And light contrast with the darkness, but it also lights a path forward.
[Heidi] Yeah, that’s totally right. I think that has an impact on every aspect of our life. Let’s jump into some of these topics for a minute because I’m curious to hear how you can help educate and encourage our listeners today. Let’s start with this. First of all, should Christians be involved in politics? Should we be educating ourselves, and what should we think, here’s a really a good one, what should we think about the upcoming election? This is a hot topic. A lot of Christians are like, “Well, I don’t like that Donald Trump. I don’t like his style. I don’t like what he says. He seems arrogant to me.” How can we engage this process from a perspective of faith?
[James] That’s a great question. I think when we think about the upcoming election or when we think about just that civic or political involvement in general, we need to realize that we have an opportunity to fulfill both a civic duty and a spiritual calling. Because as citizens, we have a moral obligation to participate in our constitutional republic. Then, if you’re a Christian, you have that spiritual obligation to, like we talked about, be salt and light by seeking the good of our community. When we look at the coming election, you need to steward your vote. You need to be considering … You and I have talked about this, it’s not about personality it’s about policy. You need to be stewarding that vote and thinking about what candidate or what candidates are going to advance the policies that are best for your community, that are best for human flourishing, and then you need to steward that vote and use it.
[Heidi] Yeah. I think, boy, someone said to me, “Well, Jesus wasn’t a politician.” But Jesus’ mission was entirely different. Jesus came here to say, “Listen, y’all have a sin problem.” God in his mercy has sent Jesus down for, he was going straight for the soul and straight for it. But he also had a heart for the hurting and a heart for the lost, absolutely. I think, “Wow, this idea that somehow we have to divorce one side of our lives and one side of our public engagement because we don’t see Jesus running for office,” seems short-sighted to me.
[James] Yeah. Well, I mean, Jesus didn’t come and die on the cross and redeem us and transform us so that then we could be quarantined from the culture. He can and saved us so that we could permeate the culture-
[Heidi] Preach it, James.
[James] Like you said, we need to be ambassadors. We need to be ambassadors to a world that needs them. Heidi, can you tell me one part of the world that doesn’t need him?
[Heidi] No. Mm-mm (negative). Honestly, I think about the things that are happening. I feel like one of the issues that we’re facing, that the church is facing, we talked about fear and I think another thing is that the enemy has done a really good job of making us feel overwhelmed. We are being bombarded from every side right now and a lot of people are just looking at it and just going, “You know what? I give up. I’m a throw my hands in the air. I don’t know what to do about it.” One of the things I try really hard not to do here is add to the noise. I don’t think it’s helpful. I like to talk about what we can do. What can we do? We pray so that we know what to do. When we talk about what’s happening in the culture, that one of the main things that I am very, very concerned about obviously, is comprehensive sex education, what’s happening in our schools right now? Certainly what’s happening in our library.
[Heidi] You have a really interesting story of what happened in your local library. Why don’t you share that with listeners? I think it’s perfectly coining what’s going on today.
[James] Yeah. This blew my mind. A few weeks ago, my wife and I took our kids to the library. There was an event going on there. We got there a little bit early and we’re just browsing through the children’s section. I see on top of one of the aisles in one of the little featured book spots, I see this book and it’s called The GayBCs. GayBCs. You can tell by the images, by the phrasing and the words. I mean, this is aimed at preschoolers. You open it up and it’s basically, it’s exactly what it says, the GayBCs. I mean, it says, “L is for lesbian. It’s love and affection between two special girls who share a connection.” It says, “T is for trans. It’s a brave step to take to live as the gender you know is innate.” I mean, it has definitions for bisexual, for drag. I mean, after all, we don’t want our kids going to the drag queen story hour unprepared, right?
[Heidi] Yes. Right?
[James] What this book was, I was floored. My mouth dropped. I didn’t even have the presence of mind to show it to my wife at the moment. I took a picture of it and I showed it to her later. I said, “This was at the library,” and she was blown away too.
[Heidi] Well, I think it’s fascinating for people, and I’ve said this a lot, but I know we have a lot of new listeners in recent months too. People need to know who the American Library Association is. This is not a family-friendly organization anymore. It has literally been overrun by radical leftists who have a very hyper-sexualized agenda that is aimed specifically at our children. That’s why you can go into a library and they’re doing exactly what you said. They’re placing these books on display. They’re colorfully worded and they’re illustrated in a way to attract young children. And parents, you can’t just let your kids roam around the library any more. in fact, I told you a few minutes ago, we quit going.
[James] Yeah. Yeah. It’s sad that that’s the reality. But you know better than anyone that the library is supposed to be a place of education and it’s turning into just a place of indoctrination.
[Heidi] Yeah, that’s right. When Christians see something like The GayBCs in the library, or we hear that Proctor and Gamble, for goodness sake, is removing the feminine symbol from their Always brand of sanitary products, and the schools are opening the girl’s bathrooms to biological males. Now my little girl is going to have to use the restroom, potentially, right next to 150, 200 pound boy. What are we supposed to do-
[James] Yeah, and maybe the locker room.
[Heidi] Yeah. It’s horrifying. I know, I’m telling parents, I’m like, “Listen, I never used to say this, but the barn is on fire. At what point do we get the horses out? At what point do we say, ‘Man, we tried everything. We threw water on it, we opened the doors, we …'” And nothing’s working. So, what can we do?
[James] Yeah. When you have Proctor and Gamble, a multinational corporation, saying that it’s not just women who menstruate-
[Heidi] Yeah, I know.
[James] Yeah. We’ve gone somewhere very foreign at that point-
[Heidi] Well, we’ve become so open-minded that our brains fell out. It’s like, “No, that doesn’t work that way.”
[James] That’s exactly what happened. Yeah. I think the first thing we need to do is we need to point that out. I mean, we need to, where we have become so divorced from reality or where, like you said, where the brain has fallen out. We need to shine a light on that and say, “Hey, everybody, look at this.” But we can’t just curse the darkness. We need to proclaim the light.
[Heidi] That’s right.
[James] So, when we see The GayBCs, we can’t just stand up and say, “That’s awful.” We need to say, “Okay, you know what? We need to redouble our efforts as parents, or as grandparents, or whatever the case may be, to educate our children about God’s plan for human sexuality.” Or when we see Proctor and Gamble saying, “Sure, men can menstruate.” We need to say, “Wait, you know what? Let’s look at how God uniquely created men and women and why we should celebrate those differences instead of denying that they exist.”
[Heidi] Yeah, I think that’s absolutely right. For the parent who just feels overwhelmed or, I know oftentimes moms are afraid to speak up. They’re afraid to come … I just got a letter from a dad the other day who went into his child’s school and was in the library for a school meeting and he saw a book on the shelf that was introducing children to transgenderism. It was talking about a young boy who’d had a sexual encounter with six-year-olds in his neighborhood. It was just horrifying. He took it to the principal and the principal took it off the shelf. Then two days later, so much pressure from the gay lobby, he put it back on. I was like, “Ding, ding, ding. Hallmark. I mean, Chick-fil-A.”
[Heidi] I mean, this is happening all over the culture right now because I think the attack really is for biblical truth, and it’s for reason and truth as God defines it. God said, “I made them male and female in my image.” Really this is an attack against the creator. It’s not an attack against people as we go, “This is an attack against people.” No, this is a spiritual battle. It’s always been raging and the enemy’s found a different way to fight.
[James] Yep. That’s why when Christians say, “I don’t want to get political,” that’s not the issue because it’s not about politics at this point. It’s about truth. It’s about spiritual reality, spiritual truth. We need to either engage or not.
[Heidi] Since we’ve already stepped in the mud, let’s muddy ourselves a little more.
[James] All right. I’m ready.
[Heidi] I’m going to ask you, get ready, James. I’m going to throw some hard balls at you. What are we supposed to make of the Chick-fil-A situation, right? I mean, I don’t know these people and I see conflicting news reports. I’m disappointed, but I also think, I don’t really … I mean, I guess they could have really easily cleared it up. I guess that’s what’s frustrating to me. I thought, “They’re going to come out, they’re going to make a really strong statement and totally clarify,” but they never did. What are we supposed to make? We know what Hellmark’s, I mean, Hallmark’s like, “I know, let’s light our corporation on fire because of pressure from the LGBT activists.” I told my husband last night, I go, “We’re literally watching Hallmark commit suicide. What’s going on?” How should we respond?
[James] Well, first of all, when people used to hear the words Chick-fil-A and chicken, there was a positive connotation. I think that moment has passed. But, yeah, it’s absolutely disappointing that they did that. At best, they made a colossal blunder in how they announced their strategic change in giving. At worst, they’re absolutely selling out their values to try and further the bottom line. I don’t know for sure which it is, but here’s the thing. Yes, we should be disappointed because of the fact that for so many years they were a voice in support of truth and they took heat for it and they stood under it and they kept going. That’s very disappointing to see them do it. But, should we feel like all hope is lost?
[James] No, I mean they’re not our surrogate for cultural involvement. Chick-fil-A, we should not expect a chicken sandwich maker to bear the standard for Christian orthodoxy.
[Heidi] That’s right.
[James] It’s great that they did, and I got a lot of satisfaction going through the drive-thru at Chick-fil-A knowing I was financially supporting a company that was standing strong. But, first and foremost, their job is to be a light and an example in the midst of the fast food industry. First and foremost as Christians, we’re supposed to be a light in the culture. So, yeah, it’s disappointing but what are we going to do about it? Are we going to take the stand that we’re criticizing them for not doing?
[Heidi] And that’s rough. You hear all these people saying, “At first we first there was Target,” right?
[Heidi] Then it’s Nordstrom. Nordstrom is absolutely one of the top promoters of the LGBT agenda. So disappointing. Someone said to me the other day, “We boycotted so many things there’s going to be nothing left.” I thought, “It can’t be, obviously it can’t always be or only be, about where we do and we don’t spend our money. But certainly it does have an impact. I mean, it’s very, very hard for me to spend my money at someplace who I know would endanger my child in the bathroom just to prove a point.” There’s the one side of it where, yes, I mean, if in good conscience we can’t support this stuff with our money. the other side of it is it’s everywhere. I guess we’ll stop eating now.
[James] Well, yeah, you look at what Hallmark did and their capitulation. I mean, they’re just following the way of culture. It’s very disappointing given how they’ve been so family-friendly in the past. But that’s not where our culture is right now and they’re following that. Again, we should be vocal in our opposition to decisions like that, but that also means that we need to redouble our commitment to shine that much brighter as Christians, and to give the world something else to look at so that then when they look at our marriages and our families, and they look at what Hallmark is offering perhaps in their next lineup of programming, they’ll go, “Wow, what the church has to offer is a lot more attractive. I want to move towards that.”
[Heidi] Yeah, that’s exactly right. You guys are going a whole long way over at the Dobson Policy Center and I love what you’re doing. In January, you guys are launching a podcast and you’re going to be talking about faith and culture. I’m just over here like doing a happy dance. I mean, anybody who will get out there and talk about faith and culture and where they intersect just makes my heart just beat because I think, “Man, we have an opportunity to be exactly who God says we are. We get to be salt and light.” And if anything, we’ve had the last 50, 60 years in this country have been very peaceful and what has happened to the church? We’ve become weak, we become lazy. We don’t know the word. then when we start having issues, we don’t know God’s word and we can’t defend it. I love what you’re doing.
[James] Thank you. Hopefully we’re going to try and follow in the footsteps of what you’re doing with your podcast. We’re just 867 issues behind.
[Heidi] That’s right. . It only took me eight years. You can do it.
[James] We’re excited. It’s going to be called Faith Meet Culture. Again, it’s just trying to help introduce Christians to the reality or the fact that we need to be involved. We can’t just keep our faith inside the four walls of our home or in the four walls of our church. Because, well, for one, they’re coming for your faith there anyway. But we need to step out and we need to live it out.
[Heidi] Yeah, that’s totally it. I want to talk for just a minute about the heartbeat behind what you’re doing over there at Dr. Dobson’s family Institute because people need to get behind it. I’d love to see people supporting what you’re doing, supporting the work of Dr. Dobson, who I have tremendous admiration and love for. He has been a voice in this culture where, and even now, there are not very many voices, I don’t think, that rival his-
[Heidi] … in terms of a willingness to step up and stand up and say, “No, not on my watch. This is not happening if I can help it.” So, how can people find out more about what you’re doing? How can they support you? Give them a shout out.
[James] Drjamesdobson.org. They’re going to find Dr. Dobson’s daily broadcast and he’s still going strong. His broadcast is better than ever. Like you said, he is one of the few people that is going to stand up and is going to speak the truth and he does not care if he gets pushback for it. He is going to do what he knows is right and he is going to encourage us to do what we know is right. He’s going to base it on God’s word.
[Heidi] And that’s the standard.
[Heidi] I mean, if we’re going to bear the standard, we are the standard-bearer and the standard is Jesus. We find out what he wants us to do in his word. I loved what you said at the beginning of the show today, where you were saying, “Listen, we’re surrounded by bad news.” We really are. I mean, on every front. And the Gospel is good news. I think we have forgotten we have good news to share. People who are caught up in the sin of homosexuality. God said, “I’m going to set you free. I can set you free.” People who are struggling in their marriages and God said, “Here’s how you can live with another person and find joy and peace and satisfaction.” It comes from knowing God’s word and living life the way our creator designed it.
[James] Yeah. Our culture is so desperately in need of it. We just did back … Obviously we just celebrated Christmas and we did a video really recently for the policy center where we went and we talked to some people and we asked them about the meaning of Christmas. There were several people that we talked to or where you ask them, “What’s the meaning of Christmas?” And they said, “Family.” I mean, just even something as basic as Christ’s birth and our culture is just aching for the Gospel.
[Heidi] We are living in a culture that is desperate for truth. I’ve often said to audiences, I speak all over the nation, and I’ve got a little break right now and I start back up in January again. I remember after Barack Obama was elected president, I remember taking a moment and the next chance I had to speak, I said, “We just elected a person to the highest office in the land because we want hope and change.” And hope and change comes from Jesus. Hope and change doesn’t come from a president. We’re never going to make America great again until we start getting on our faces before the Lord, until God’s people start to be who God says we are, which is to bear the message of the good news of the Gospel and that changes people.
[Heidi] In the meantime, you and I just had this discussion, I want to wrap this up today because I think it’s important. When we are talking about policy, and when we’re talking about candidates, because it’s an election year. 2020 is a big year, and one of the things I’ve been trying to do here is getting people off the bench and onto the battlefield and saying, “Run for office. Look and see where the places are in your area.” I mean, a lot of us think, “Oh, that’s somebody else’s job.” No, it’s not. You live here, it’s your job. Every single one of us has an opportunity and we think, “Oh, school boards, who cares? Oh, parks and rec board. Who cares? Oh, the port authority, who cares?” Well, guess what? All I got to do is come to Vancouver, Washington or Seattle or Portland, Oregon, and see who is holding these so-called small positions and the massive changes that it’s made in our cities to see, wow, it really does matter.
[James] That’s right. Politics. It begins and ends with local.
[Heidi] Yep. Yep. Absolutely. People can do it. I think sometimes we think, “Oh, it doesn’t really matter and things are going to pan out in the end.” But man, I just don’t see that that’s our civic responsibility at all. I really appreciate what you’re doing is just thrilling to me. It just given me goosebumps, just reading what you guys are doing and saying, “Thank you Lord,” for continuing to use the ministry of Dr. Dobson and growing it in the culture today. It’s so needed.
[James] Thank you, Heidi. And thank you for everything that you’re doing.
[Heidi] Well, I appreciate your presence here and I hope that we have you back on the show again and we’ll stay in touch. If you guys want more information about what’s happening over at the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute, I’m going to encourage you to go back to the show notes today, drjamesdobson.org, and you can also follow Dr. Dobson’s Policy Institute online, the Dobson Policy Center. I’m going to link back to all of these things over at my Facebook page today and also at the show notes at heidistjohn.com/podcast.
I want to encourage you guys again, we’re just starting up a brand new Bible study at MomStrong International. We’re coming up on 15,000 of you every month writing those scriptures out with us and we’ve got a wonderful opportunity for you to start sending cards in the mail to other women and just saying, “Hey, you are loved,” and write down your verse that you’re studying and remind them that they are who God says they are. Really you guys, that’s the bottom line. We belong to the Lord of heaven’s armies, let’s live like it. Thanks everybody for listening today. We really appreciate it and I’ll see you back here on Monday.
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Heidi St. John
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